Astros & Guardians & Pirates
Submitted by: SportsCoach
Astros
| Name | Age | Level | P1 | P2 | Availability | Years | AFV | Salary | Surplus | Low | Median | High |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Joey Bart | 29 | Majors | C | High | 2 | 12.9 | 6.3 | 6.5 | 5.2 | 6.5 | 7.8 | |
| Steven Kwan | 28 | Majors | OF | Low | 2 | 47.6 | 19.3 | 28.3 | 22.6 | 28.3 | 33.9 | |
| Wyatt Sanford | 20 | Minors | SS | 0 | 0 | 0 | 6.8 | 5.4 | 6.8 | 8.1 |
Total Value:
41.60
Guardians
| Name | Age | Level | P1 | P2 | Availability | Years | AFV | Salary | Surplus | Low | Median | High |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Jake Meyers | 30 | Majors | OF | Low | 2 | 23.6 | 8.9 | 14.7 | 11.8 | 14.7 | 17.6 | |
| Spencer Arrighetti | 26 | Majors | SP | 4 | 19.1 | 10.2 | 8.8 | 7.1 | 8.8 | 10.6 | ||
| Zach Dezenzo | 26 | Majors | OF | 1B | 5 | 3.4 | 0 | 3.4 | 2.7 | 3.4 | 4.1 | |
| Brice Matthews | 24 | Majors | SS | 6 | 12.1 | 3.1 | 9 | 7.2 | 9 | 10.8 |
Total Value:
35.9
Pirates
| Name | Age | Level | P1 | P2 | Availability | Years | AFV | Salary | Surplus | Low | Median | High |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Isaac Paredes | 27 | Majors | 3B | Low | 2 | 36.2 | 23.4 | 12.8 | 10.3 | 12.8 | 15.4 | |
| Johnathan Rodriguez | 26 | Majors | OF | 5 | 3.7 | 2.3 | 1.4 | 1.1 | 1.4 | 1.6 |
Total Value:
14.20
Comments
21
I feel this fits the Guardians type of return... Fills in all the needs... Cleveland has Meyers as a 4th OF not starter value as well...
Pittsburgh is not interested in this return. Rodriguez value is inflated. He is not MLB and likely will not be. They are not giving away C Joey Bart for Rodriguez.
Not exactly. Put it this way. Rodriguez could have 8 years of control and Pittsburgh is not interested. He is not MLB player. Valera ,by value here, would be acceptable. Not Rodriguez. Valera looks like better player in most every phase. Pittsburgh likely would take Valera. Halpin offers more than Rodriguez, but unfortunately can't hit. That's my effort to help clear up your thought about my read.
The thing is it is Paredes for Bart and Sanford... JRod has nothing to do with this deal other than being a throw in, literally he is just there because Cleveland is cutting him so the Pirates are just having the choice of keeping him or DFA'ing him... I am not sure why you focused on JRod when Paredes is the actual piece in the deal... Valera is not available as a throw in since they won't be cutting him and won't be willing to move him at such a low value... Plus the Pirates already had their chance to get Valera...
I don't know how you determined this bs, but that's exactly what it is at this point. We should compare Rodriguez, Dezenzo and Valera's career minor league numbers because none of them have enough ML AB to suggest anything.
My opinion(BS) is as valid as your opinion , also BS. I accept the term because it is comfortably in my vocabulary. No offense taken. Throw in Mayo(Balt) for another stat reference. He has minor league stats that seem to indicate unachieved MLB results. So my rating of minor league stats are only reference points, with reservation.(like when PCL minor league is termed 'hitter friendly')
No, you specifically stated Rodriguez "is not a MLB player". No mention of opinion. Didn't say "I don't think Rodriguez is a MLB player". It's BS because you stated something as fact that you don't know and there isn't evidence to prove what you stated. In fact, there is good evidence to suggest the opposite. I don't care if you take offense to it or not. Sometimes the truth is offensive.
how about the fact that Rodriguez can't make Cleveland's OF as evidence of him not being MLB player? How old is he by now...
Last try for me. Cleveland can keep (and DFA) Rodriguez. Pittsburgh does not want to waste the inevitable paperwork. He is not MLB. If you want to keep the same players only in this proposal, then Cleveland keeps Rodriguez and Dezenzo can go to Pittsburgh. Maybe Pittsburgh will go for that. Otherwise, as proposed, Pittsburgh is not interested.
Cleveland isnt doing the deal without Dezenzo mostly because Meyers is not worth 14... May have to pick someone different from Cleveland's farm...
I'd like to know how you determine Rodriguez is or is not a ML hitter. Please tell me you're not basing that off of his measly, scattered 77 AB across 2 partial seasons. Please tell me you looked at his minor league career along with the age at each level and the numbers he put up. The problem with Rodriguez is finding him a defensive home. His best position is probably LF, but he has a cannon for an arm so if he can improve his reads then he would be a capable RFer as well. I have to have Dezenzo in this deal and I'm not confident that Rodriguez isn't a better hitter.
I am determining Rodriguez as a not-MLB player. Hitting may well be his best trait. I am not saying he couldn't possibly hit in MLB. Certainly fielding is not. He is not a MLB fielder (player). He is not going to improve his reads and angles to the necessary degree. Perhaps he is a DH with no defensive value OR hopefully some value if LF is available. Maybe some team wants to tie up DH and plug him in. Doubtful but possible. As far as 'in this deal' goes, all I am saying Pittsburgh is not interested in Rodriguez as a player due to aforementioned reasons. Did not focus on others but dropping Derenzo was simply a way the deal could be reconstructed to level values and keep only the others in it. inserting Valera for Rodriguez would be a possible change that kept all other pieces in place.
It would be easier just to pull out JRod and pick someone not on their MLB roster, throw me names... But Dezenzo has to be in the deal to make the deal worth Cleveland doing it... I added in JRod as a filler since he is a filler player and I will be honest... JRod has a good enough bat to be a career 10 WAR player... Problem is he cannot field... Cleveland likes to have a rotating DH especially with JRam going to retire with the Guardians now (JRam will get at least one day a week as a DH) and Manzardo is looking like a DH himself at 1B... My issue with this whole thing is you are negating a deal over a 1.4 value player, when he was a throw and wasn't even thrown in to match values... This deal was also offered before Ozuna was signed... JRod can and will hit MLB pitching if full time ABs he just should never see green grass and also JRod has an option. Cleveland is not offering Valera since he isn't a filler player.... So Pirates would have to pick likely a minor league pitcher around the same value then or something...
I understand the problem with Rodriguez. He cannot play in the field at MLB level. It's pure BS that he would be regular DH as teams avoid that scenario 95%. Which team would tie up DH position daily with Rodriguez? Send him there. Also in this somewhat lopsided trade, Houston gives up a lot of youth and point value for C2 platoon and All Star Kwan. I am not interested in going by your devaluation of Meyers attempting to justify the 13 or so disparity between Cleveland and Houston. I would vote no as Pittsburgh, no as constructed as Houston.
Not sure how you got 13... Houston has what 49 going out and getting 41 back... Cleveland is going to have Kwan at a higher value and Meyers at a lower value than listed... Kwan high is 33 and Meyers low is 11... Which puts Astros going out at 46 and going in at 46... The numbers arent 13 off... It's honestly less than 8... This is a three team trade and I went by rumors which actually stated Bart would be coming back in the Paredes deal hence why I added in a prospect to the Astros...
the 13 was derived as such: Houston is -7.10 and Cleveland is +6.20...so 13.3 .I do not subscibe to your BS that Cleveland players are 'undervalue' while Houston (and all others) are overvalued. I am going off this sites valuations. So 13.3 difference.
That is a silly way since the difference is because Kwan is 28 and Cleveland got back 35... That is 7 not 13 even if you use the numbers here, it is only a 7 difference which was accepted by the trade machine...
Meyers is a banjo hitter that Cleveland clearly has no interest in.
NEWSLETTER? SURE, SIGN ME UP!
Huh... Bart is a part of the deal for Paredes and has nothing to do with Rodriguez at all... Rodriguez technically has an option and 6 years of control left not 5, he is just a thrown in that can actually hit, his fielding is just too atrocious to make Cleveland's team... I feel like you read it wrong... Pittsburgh is getting Paredes plus JRod for Bart and Sanford...
I actually agree that they wouldn't part with Bart for Rodriguez, but how is Rodriguez's value "inflated". You like to throw statements out there so what facts do you have to support that? I ask only because I don't think you understand how good of a minor league hitter Rodriguez has been, and at young ages for each level. I'll give you a good comparison to JRod as far as minor league numbers and that is Teoscar Hernandez. If I recall correctly, Rodriguez's numbers were slightly better.
my 'valuation' is based on Rodriguez inability to play anywhere. Maybe he can stand in LF well enough to merit value. so maybe I was too harsh. Certainly, his inability to crack Cleveland's OF is telltale, but Kwan blocks him in LF, so give him a temporary pass. His minor league statistics are impressive enough but are not to be confused with MLB. Watching is another method to assess, and it's creditable. Most of my evaluation of him comes from watching him play. So there are not too many facts, as you requested. He did have a ton of errors in RF in the Minors if that would count. I can see why.